Wooden stair way to Heaven - historical references?

ManicMan

ManicMan

Lord
Okay, I've finally gotten back to my gaming boards and I hope to show a picture of one new one I've completed but I'm working on the next. The three I'm doing are cliff faces. I'll go into more details on my thread about the boards when I get them photos and stuff..

Anyway.. I want to have one which has a stair way leading up the Clift face to give access to the top. At first I was going to go for carved rock steps but I've been thinking I really wanna do a wood stair way instead. sadly, alot of the old wood steps don't exist these days because after a few hundred years, they get a bit rotten. Though there are tons of more modern versions around. Problem is, I'm trying to find some good examples of what I have in mind, or atleast to know if it's kinda possible. not a solid build stair case but more where a series of platforms have been fitted into the rock wall of a more sheer cliff face. Probably using log-like beams underneath to give a solid base (kinda a few horizonal and a couple of diagonal under for support), onto which a platform is placed. Not 100% sure if I wanna do a hand rail as I don't see this as a pedestrian path way.

Any idea if this sounds feasible.. I mean, for a model, yes it is, but as something 'real'?
 
There seem to be various wooden stairways, and bits that look more like ladders on cliffs in China in particular if you're looking for some photographic inspiration. Some of the higher mountain US mines also have some spectacular wood work perched on mountain sides.

Feasibility in real life - I don't see why not. You'd need to "drill" holes into the cliff large enough to take your horizontal timbers, but that could be done from rigging. Lifting the beams can also be done - especially if you have access to work from the top down. Then depending on the load you're expecting some bracing timbers are probably no bad thing. I imagine the natural formations would be used as much as possible to support or even be carved as steps in places. I'd say the most difficult thing is figuring out how a switchback would work since you don't want to waste space and timber building too far out from the rock face just to accommodate the back and forth. Maybe you'd have more ladder like sections between the direction changes or maybe it's bodged with some kind of landing. Anyhow if there was a good reason I expect it would be done!
 
haven't gotten the under support but a very rough quick mock up of something I was wondering about:
Mock1.png
for gaming reasons, the large platforms are about 30 x 35 mm, and about 20mm height differences. (yes, This cliff boards are a bit tall but it's for a couple of reasons). It seamed to be too big a gap between each one, so added a smaller half size one at the middle point, so each 'step' is 10mm apart, which should be fine for most things. Of course, no rock face texturing here but I got a plaster cliff mould as well as want to do a bit more so there should be some good texture and some small outcrops which can help with some extra support. Basic idea 'in real world explaining' (if that makes sense) is that the round supports have been forced into the rock face with supported planking ontop. While I thought there were some like it in Japan, I think I'm thinking of the Chinese Gallery Roads really. So I think having a bit under neath which will then fasten for extra under support would be good..

wonder If I'm over thinking this... eh, the research and thinking about stuff is fun ^_^ shame I can normally THINK I'm planning stuff well but then it falls apart
 
Looks like it could have potential. I'd say look to ways to make it less uniform to make it more interesting - so vary the heights a bit and so forth. Granted you need to keep it suitable for gaming! Maybe just the cliff face will do this to an extent, but I'd certainly try to mix it up a bit.

Interested to see it as it comes together.
 
yep. the platforms I want to make out of bits so they should be a bit more rough, and they will probably not all be perfectly straight and stuff ^_^
 
still could have sworn there were a few in rural Japan but I can't find images of them. due to the shared culture (to a degree of course) of China and Japan, it wouldn't be too much of a surprise to have similar things. Both are good at construction to match what is needed, often at the expense of 'disposable' work force. Though in Japan, there is more likely some Hitobashira in the designs.. though of course, that was common in China for a while too.. though I believe there is more just legend and rumours then proof of the practice there.. but I'm not up on Chinese ^_^; I can say Hello in Mandarin and Cantonese though...
 
I'd definitely recommend making some kind of railing to keep minis from diving off the steps. Maybe instead of handrail you could make two or more posts and tie a cord between them at suitable height?

Not quite the same as what you're planning, but idea and execution with stairs on this mordheim building I made ages ago is perhaps similar enough to make it worth sharing. Realism took the passenger's seat and practicality on gaming table and ease of putting this together were my priorities. Instead of handrail I went with a beam placed just slightly above steps; just high enough to keep minis in place.
Mordheim building 01.jpgMordheim building 02.jpg

What's at the end of the stairway you're building? I thought maybe a small shrine carved on rock face or something else halfway through the stairs might make an interesting little addition to it.
 
Okay.. got some stuff on order which should turn up tomorrow and hopefully I got enough poly filla cause the local shop where I got the stuff cheap from closed down for a couple of reasons (it wasn't losing money, it was more not worth it to keep it open in the view of some of the owners who have other businesses too).

Anyway.. while I'm waiting, I started construction of the first platform. I've already got the basics of the tile done, though I'll be doing some more carving and bits. first platform looks good. I decided to use 'pins' to attach the main round 'logs' to the clift. Basically, drilling a small hole in the middle of them and in the clift for about half a cocktail stick as a pin more then drilling larger holes for the whole dowel to go in. should help with support and even if not, just makes it a bit easier for me I think..

anyway.. first platform worked out about 18mm from the base ground level, but when the ground has been finished, it'll probebly be a little higher. I had designed the steps being 20mm apart height wise, but then decided that was too big so made the smaller ones at 10mm gaps but I'm really not sure about that.. now seeing it in person, I'm not sure if 20mm is too far apart height wise.. also debating on some various rule sets in what they say about going up steps.

Most of what I remember and know more deal with slopes then stairs up a sheer cliff. Though the fact of the sheer Clift shouldn't really make a difference. Characters can normal go up hills or anything as long as it's within their movement and can physically be placed there. so should be fine. Kinda the balance between realistic and looks good. 20mm apart steps would be.. 4 and a half feet or so in real life.. that isn't a good thing to climb up. But of course, doing it based on real life means... yikes.. real life has between 127mm to 228mm between steps.. convert that scale and.. about 2 and a half mm height I think.. That isn't gonna be something I'm doing.
 
sketchup, old-ish version before they went completely stupid but were already a bit stupid. It's basically designed for architecture like floor plans and stuff, But it's a program I get on with. you can buy some plug-ins (it uses Ruby for coding plug-ins mostly) which can do some automatic stuff and help with organic shapes but I'm okay are modelling older style, vector by vector.
 
^_^ oh? you need to tweak the settings to not had stupid holes and some stuff, but that's built in settings. Don't know if they changed it since 2017 when they stopped a free version, but never had any 3D printing issues from it. But I can see how people not knowing much about 3D printing and thinking you can just take a 3D model from a game or something and 'sent to printer' would create alot of problems
 
Whilst we're on a tangent (I'm sure Manic will forgive me!) - for some reason I never really got on as well with "proper 3D" CAD packages - I excelled with the older hybrid 2D/3D where you designed in 2D and had to extrude it all into 3D - it as all Medusa then for me on Sun workstations, but when we moved to SolidWorks and ProEngineer for some reason I found it much harder to think 3D first! Very odd given it was supposed to be the natural way of doing it and everyone else had a much harder time doing things the other way. It might have been that I'd had more experience drafting on paper than the others in the group so Medusa came very naturally. Somewhat later I did a bit of a stint with Maya and 3D StudioMax, but it's been years since I bashed anything now. I keep thinking I should give Blender a go and actually print something I've made!
 
did try Maya, did try 3D studioMax, tried AutoCad, tried OpenSCad tried and still kinda do a tiny bit with Blender but.. it's not designed for a laptop.. if you don't have a scroll wheel button, it wants to make life hard.. years ago, there was a program called Milkshape which I enjoyed and was basic. Also used a program designed for converting 3d models to flash which was pretty nice for what it was. Also used a few different ones though the years... god, been too long and I guess I was never interested enough to really focus on making 3D modelling my main thing. Tried Zbrush but really didn't get on with that..
 
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