Mengil Manhide's Manflayers

ardyer

ardyer

Baron
Does anyone know where I can find the 3rd ed. rules for these guys?

I was going through some early 4th ed. dark elf blisters I've acquired and found that the models for Mengil and the musician. On the off chance I ever get to play some oldhammer, I'd also like to have their rules without having to ebay an empty box for them.
 
Zhu Bajie":2jqpord9 said:
Play 2nd edition. It's the bestest!
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They guy that owned the shop I gamed at in undergrad felt the same way. In fact he was so angered at GW when they replaced it with 3rd ed. that he quit playing. He still complained about it when I was there, circa 5th and 6th ed.

Sadly, he's also the only one I know with a copy of 2nd ed, or I'd be more than happy to give that a try too!
 
Just John":2kkll44s said:
I'm not sure if there were 3rd edition rules but here are the 2nd ed stats which are easy enough to adapt
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After much poking around the internet and my copies of WFB 3rd and Warhammer Armies, I have to ask, how? :oops: WFB 3rd mentions that the stats from 2nd should be good, but the points are all wrong. But then fails to detail how to fix it.
 
ardyer":1uwceguh said:
Just John":1uwceguh said:
I'm not sure if there were 3rd edition rules but here are the 2nd ed stats which are easy enough to adapt
Click to expand...

After much poking around the internet and my copies of WFB 3rd and Warhammer Armies, I have to ask, how? :oops: WFB 3rd mentions that the stats from 2nd should be good, but the points are all wrong. But then fails to detail how to fix it.
Click to expand...

And that is why 3rd Edition totally SUCKS ARSE lol!

The points are not all wrong, at all, 90% of the PVs used in 3rd are exactly the same as in 2nd Edition, s have had the fractions rounded up, but most are the same. Halflings are different, as are Lizardmen, Werewolves are totally overexpensive. But yeah most stuff is the same. All you really need to do is add the Personal Characteristic modifiers, which is simply the difference between the normal, basic troop type, and the heroes profile, and use the 2E PVs.
 
Zhu Bajie":2z2gk5wn said:
ardyer":2z2gk5wn said:
Just John":2z2gk5wn said:
I'm not sure if there were 3rd edition rules but here are the 2nd ed stats which are easy enough to adapt
Click to expand...

After much poking around the internet and my copies of WFB 3rd and Warhammer Armies, I have to ask, how? :oops: WFB 3rd mentions that the stats from 2nd should be good, but the points are all wrong. But then fails to detail how to fix it.
Click to expand...

And that is why 3rd Edition totally SUCKS ARSE lol!

The points are not all wrong, at all, 90% of the PVs used in 3rd are exactly the same as in 2nd Edition, s have had the fractions rounded up, but most are the same. Halflings are different, as are Lizardmen, Werewolves are totally overexpensive. But yeah most stuff is the same. All you really need to do is add the Personal Characteristic modifiers, which is simply the difference between the normal, basic troop type, and the heroes profile, and use the 2E PVs.
Click to expand...

Thanks!
 
Indeed they are. In 3rd there is overall an attempt to make the lesser undead costs reflect some of their situational modifiers (Fear, Psych-immune, etc.) however this wasn't done across the board - Goblinoid animosity for example, doesn't make Orcs cheaper, and the whole points system stopped being a rational abstraction of a given troops combat values and starts being a wishy-washy variable based more on the personal preferences of the designers than an emergent property of the system they had designed. Have I already said 3rd sucks arse? ;)

Fortunately these modifiers don't effect Elves (Dark or otherwise), we're quite safe using 2E rules for Scarloc and Mengil.
 
Just forget about the PV's , place all the minis on the table and have fun :grin: Heroic last stands, victory against the odds and crushing defeats are all where the fun is at.
 
Zhu Bajie":1a2z4xax said:
Fortunately these modifiers don't effect Elves (Dark or otherwise), we're quite safe using 2E rules for Scarloc and Mengil.
Click to expand...

After looking over the presented stats for Mengil and the Warhammer Armies Dark Elves, I do think the point values for the Champion and Standard are off, but those should be easy fixes.

Of course this is all somewhat of an abstract enterprise for myself anyway. I don't have any local oldhammer players anyway and my boys are way to young to be my opponents :lol:
 
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